I've come across a few horses like this...all I can say is don't over use the whip because he is probably already unaffected by it. However, when you do make it count. He is probably already desensitized from the over use of it and lack of motivation. As soon as he shows a response, immediately reward him (treats, praise, petting and scratching him or in other ways) and keep things interesting and keep trying different things so he won't lose interest. Other than that all I can say is good luck and I hope some of that will be helpful!
Again it doesn't do anything. He couldn't care less.
If he's disrespectful enough to ignore your commands, smack him a bit. He knows better, it's like spanking a child; last resort. If he doesn't want to get whipped, he can pony up and do as he's told.
Sorry about that! I felt like I was giving a lecture that I was always given. but like I said I had one I desensitized too much and I had a lazy mare but she was terrified of bags plastic bags (I used that to my advantage) but she was definitely not as bad. I don't know if you found anything I said worth while. Good luck with him.
I'm actually a trainer but have never dealt with dead broke, bomb proof lazy as hell horses. All my others are the complete opposite end of the spectrum. I'm honestly wondering if he is just so desensitized and hates work because he's sick of it. He's super well trained and extremely good under saddle (minus the fact that you have to wear spurs because he's completely dead sided). He's just....lazy. Just wanted to see if anyone had anything I haven't tried. Ugh give me a psycho OTTB anyday.
I seen you have done just about everything you could and I personally train and ride quite a few pleasure horses. I can say most are bomb proof like you say and I accidentally desensitized my horse to much and had the exact same problems but luckily since I did it, I caught it soon. Basically you have to find a way to sensitize him again to the lunge line. I am not sure what you are planning on doing with him so it is hard to say what you should do. I would guess you are just trying to work him so you need to get his mind active and listening to you. I would do a few things.
If he does well in hand (not on lunge line) try doing showmanship patterns like pivots and a lot of backing. Backing engages the horses mind more than a lot of forward actions. Try making him cross his legs over (making him think how to undo them)
You could also make him yield his hindquarters and forequarters. This will force him to watch and pay attention to you.
take a chain over his nose (NOT through his mouth!!! that can damage it) and apply pressure when he listens, let off at the slightest movement. This will sensitize your horse to the softest commands even without working so hard to get a reaction out of him.
You can try riding him too. Back him up a lot. Make him engage his hindquarters. Side passing can help with that too (crossing his legs and making him undo them).
The most important thing I can stress is start over. Work at small intervals like 30 minutes. If he is doing well stop. leave on a good note. It is one the hardest things to do is stop once you have made any progress but it will help so much more than to keep nagging him (that can make it worse) Also pressure and release if my best friend. I say start with ground work yielding doing pressure and release. Make sure to release after any movement of the feet but not just leaning away! One last thing. If he will not do anything, yank of his the chain. I do not like doing it but with youngster I sometimes have to. (even my older ones every once in awhile)
I know it was a lot but I am not sure what exactly your goal is so I tried giving you option. Hope something helps! Good luck.
Does he react well to noice? Sorry I'm out of ideas.. good luck, hope you find something that works!
I deleted my previous comments so that other people are more likely to reply :)
He does but let's be realistic. I want him to be the one lunging and working not me.
I want to see his back move from withers to hip to spot the weaknesses and tight areas.
I want to work on his top line and be able to see what needs to be worked, and do trot poles. I don't want to have to tack him up and ride just to give him a bit of exercise.
I am not babying him. I have smacked him with the whip. He. Does. Not. Care. I have used plastic bags on whips, I have used round pens, I have free lunged with another horse (worked the best), I have chased him, yelled at him, and even tied a tarp to him. He is dead broke, bomb proof and as lazy as can be.
Dont. Baby. Him. Use a round pen until he gets it. Scream bloody murder at him and CHASE him with a trash bag flapping. He needs to learn that go means GO. Use Clinton Anderson method as a loose template of what to do.
I've done all that. I've snapped the lunge line directly behind his tail and he just flicks an ear at it and continues doing bare minimum.